Suboxone induction and taper plan
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: syracuse ny
Posts: 8
Suboxone induction and taper plan
HI, I'm new to this site, but have been reading alot of posts on here. My husband and I have been addicted to opiates for 5 years. We have tried cold turkey several times only to relapse again. Finally this time it seems to be working with the help of suboxone. We have been sober for 21 days now and are doing well. The reason for my post is there seems to be alot of confusion with the right way of tapering off of suboxone. So I wanted to post an article from another recovery site drugs.com It has been very helpful to us and i hope maybe it will be able to help someone else. I don't know why doctors seem to put people on such high doses of suboxone it's really not necessary on the induction day take 2mg at a time till you get comfortable and level off there for a while. I think being put on such high doses makes it so your on it for monthes or even years. I'm on 2mg a day now, next week we'll be going down to 1.5mg. So far so good. I am defintley not a doctor but have followed this plan precisley and it does seem to be affective. after being on high amounts of oxycontin, opana, hydros, percs, anything we could get for years, this is the only thing that has helped keep us clean. I don't want to go back to life ever. I hope will be helpful to some. like i said i'm new here I read more than i post. But would defintley like to get to know people here and have the support from others who have been through this.
Melanie
INDUCTION
This is one of the most important parts of sub therapy. If a person is not inducted properly they most always experience ongoing problems. The standard method of administering 8mg followed by an additional 8mg and so on until we often see patients being inducted with amounts as high as 32mg and more consistently proves to NOT be in the patient’s best interest.
The purpose of induction is quite simply to stabilize the patient. But we find the induction most effective when the patient is inducted at the lowest dose possible. We suggest using 2mg dosing increments dispensed at least one hour apart. This allows the patient plenty of time to make sure they are receiving maximum benefit from the medication with each additional dose. We seldom find it necessary to induct ANYONE at any more than 8mg. We have people who have inducted at 4mg – 6mg and done very well.
The people who do best historically are those who begin this therapy at the lowest effective dose. This can only be determined by a slow induction process administering minimal amounts of medication at each dosing. There are instances where higher doses are required but we still find it in the patient’s best interest to always follow the aforementioned process. 2mg drug increases administered at least an hour apart is the best way in which to determine the most effective induction amount required.
We have found things work best when the induction process lasts for a period of three days. The first day is when the patient is initially stabilized. On the second day the induction dose is split into two equal doses as this will help with making tapering easier later in the process. At the end of three days we find that the dose used to stabilize the patient can be reduced by 25% and this becomes the lowest effective dose. So doing all of this takes three days. For example if you are inducted at 8mg then after three days you should be fine reducing your dose to 6mg. This is where the patient remains until they begin to taper down their respective doses.
Allowing three days provides ample time to adjust the induction dose as may be required to maintain the stability of the patient. Those patients who don’t stabilize properly have problems throughout their therapy. That is true 100% of the time. The amount used to stabilize doesn’t seem to be as important as the process by which the induction is done.
TAPERING
We are only going to address tapers from the induction process through reaching 4mg. Once you reach 4mg the thing that has made us successful is dealing with each person individually and according to their individual symptoms. If you have difficulty at 6mg rather than 4mg then get with us individually at that point. You may do just fine on your own all the way to 0mg following this taper plan. It’s quite obvious that we are all different to an extent.
The problems we see most often with traditional sub drs’ treatment programs are that they are very expensive and they are all the same just about regarding method. Initially the patient is RXd a high amount of medication (as much as 16-32mg are seen often) when NO ONE here ever required over 12mg in an induction (as of 12/18/08). Most are 8mg or less.
We begin tapering down until we get to the 4mg level and then we try to work individually with members. It’s quite basic reducing to 4mg. That can be accomplished by a formula. But getting to 0mg is more difficult especially for those who come to this site having been on sub elsewhere for a long time or some other type or circumstance.
Some people taper right down to zero with the standard tapering formula. That is if you will reduce by 25% of the total daily dose and maintain that dose for a period of four full days while experiencing no w/d symptoms it’s safe to reduce again by another 25% and expect the same results. If you experience any w/d symptoms during the four day period you can take .5mg sliver and the w/d symptoms usually dissipate immediately. If you require slivers to remain stable at any level you should start over the next day trying to put four days together again.
The reason for sometimes feeling w/d symptoms is the long half life of buprenorphine, the main drug that is in sub. To be very simple it can take days before we experience the w/d symptoms from sub. So this is why we wait for four days to allow for the half life. When we make it four days without symptoms we should be fine reducing again.
It’s not uncommon to have some minor side effects from sub as with almost any medication. There can be some depression, sleep problems, anxiety. So we suggest not taking the sub close to bedtime, get some mild to moderate exercise depending on your condition, there are things to do that will help lots of things. But stick with the same principles all the way down as far as you are comfortable. We are here to help at that point.
Robert_325
__________________
Melanie
INDUCTION
This is one of the most important parts of sub therapy. If a person is not inducted properly they most always experience ongoing problems. The standard method of administering 8mg followed by an additional 8mg and so on until we often see patients being inducted with amounts as high as 32mg and more consistently proves to NOT be in the patient’s best interest.
The purpose of induction is quite simply to stabilize the patient. But we find the induction most effective when the patient is inducted at the lowest dose possible. We suggest using 2mg dosing increments dispensed at least one hour apart. This allows the patient plenty of time to make sure they are receiving maximum benefit from the medication with each additional dose. We seldom find it necessary to induct ANYONE at any more than 8mg. We have people who have inducted at 4mg – 6mg and done very well.
The people who do best historically are those who begin this therapy at the lowest effective dose. This can only be determined by a slow induction process administering minimal amounts of medication at each dosing. There are instances where higher doses are required but we still find it in the patient’s best interest to always follow the aforementioned process. 2mg drug increases administered at least an hour apart is the best way in which to determine the most effective induction amount required.
We have found things work best when the induction process lasts for a period of three days. The first day is when the patient is initially stabilized. On the second day the induction dose is split into two equal doses as this will help with making tapering easier later in the process. At the end of three days we find that the dose used to stabilize the patient can be reduced by 25% and this becomes the lowest effective dose. So doing all of this takes three days. For example if you are inducted at 8mg then after three days you should be fine reducing your dose to 6mg. This is where the patient remains until they begin to taper down their respective doses.
Allowing three days provides ample time to adjust the induction dose as may be required to maintain the stability of the patient. Those patients who don’t stabilize properly have problems throughout their therapy. That is true 100% of the time. The amount used to stabilize doesn’t seem to be as important as the process by which the induction is done.
TAPERING
We are only going to address tapers from the induction process through reaching 4mg. Once you reach 4mg the thing that has made us successful is dealing with each person individually and according to their individual symptoms. If you have difficulty at 6mg rather than 4mg then get with us individually at that point. You may do just fine on your own all the way to 0mg following this taper plan. It’s quite obvious that we are all different to an extent.
The problems we see most often with traditional sub drs’ treatment programs are that they are very expensive and they are all the same just about regarding method. Initially the patient is RXd a high amount of medication (as much as 16-32mg are seen often) when NO ONE here ever required over 12mg in an induction (as of 12/18/08). Most are 8mg or less.
We begin tapering down until we get to the 4mg level and then we try to work individually with members. It’s quite basic reducing to 4mg. That can be accomplished by a formula. But getting to 0mg is more difficult especially for those who come to this site having been on sub elsewhere for a long time or some other type or circumstance.
Some people taper right down to zero with the standard tapering formula. That is if you will reduce by 25% of the total daily dose and maintain that dose for a period of four full days while experiencing no w/d symptoms it’s safe to reduce again by another 25% and expect the same results. If you experience any w/d symptoms during the four day period you can take .5mg sliver and the w/d symptoms usually dissipate immediately. If you require slivers to remain stable at any level you should start over the next day trying to put four days together again.
The reason for sometimes feeling w/d symptoms is the long half life of buprenorphine, the main drug that is in sub. To be very simple it can take days before we experience the w/d symptoms from sub. So this is why we wait for four days to allow for the half life. When we make it four days without symptoms we should be fine reducing again.
It’s not uncommon to have some minor side effects from sub as with almost any medication. There can be some depression, sleep problems, anxiety. So we suggest not taking the sub close to bedtime, get some mild to moderate exercise depending on your condition, there are things to do that will help lots of things. But stick with the same principles all the way down as far as you are comfortable. We are here to help at that point.
Robert_325
__________________
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: syracuse ny
Posts: 8
stagebear, no not my doctor he wanted us to take a much higher dose and we didn't want to do that. We did alot of looking into this suboxone treatment and we din't want to be on it for years you know ? I have been visiting the drugs.com forum for a couple monthes and have been in touch with robert 325 who origionally wrote the post about the induction. he was an addict at one time, and now he just helps people get clean. he really knows what he's talking about with the suboxone.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Midland, NC
Posts: 1,266
Melanie, Hi and welcome. First of all, congrats on you and your husband being clean for 21 days...awesome. I'm a recovering opiate/cocaine addict, 17 months clean. Before rehab, I was swallowing 30, 10mg tabs of hydro or oxycodones each day, plus, snorting/smoking a LOT of coke.
I was introduced to Sub on the seventh day of detox in rehab...It took that long for my insurance provider to approve it's use...so, I didn't get to use sub as a means of avoiding withdrawl...which, I now think that was a good thing because those horrible memories keep me from ever wanting to put an opiate in my mouth ever again. I had abused pain pills for more than ten years, after an accident.
They started me on 16mg while in rehab, but not long after I got out, I cut that down to 8mg...mainly because they're so expensive. I have now been on a taper from the 8mg doing pretty much what the article suggest...cutting down every three or four days. I have had some anxiety and depression, plus, some headaches, but nothing in compared to w/ding from opiates. I do believe that once I'm down to 1/2mg, I'm gonna stay there for a little while.
I have always been an advocate for Suboxone. It has afforded me the time to get used to recovery, without the cravings and obsession for those damn pills. I do believe that using sub for only reasons to avoid w/d or to use them without the true desire to change and having a program in place will not be successful...if you don't have the desire to be clean, the subs will be just another pill.
Thank you for posting...keep doing so and let us know how you and your husband are.
Penny
I was introduced to Sub on the seventh day of detox in rehab...It took that long for my insurance provider to approve it's use...so, I didn't get to use sub as a means of avoiding withdrawl...which, I now think that was a good thing because those horrible memories keep me from ever wanting to put an opiate in my mouth ever again. I had abused pain pills for more than ten years, after an accident.
They started me on 16mg while in rehab, but not long after I got out, I cut that down to 8mg...mainly because they're so expensive. I have now been on a taper from the 8mg doing pretty much what the article suggest...cutting down every three or four days. I have had some anxiety and depression, plus, some headaches, but nothing in compared to w/ding from opiates. I do believe that once I'm down to 1/2mg, I'm gonna stay there for a little while.
I have always been an advocate for Suboxone. It has afforded me the time to get used to recovery, without the cravings and obsession for those damn pills. I do believe that using sub for only reasons to avoid w/d or to use them without the true desire to change and having a program in place will not be successful...if you don't have the desire to be clean, the subs will be just another pill.
Thank you for posting...keep doing so and let us know how you and your husband are.
Penny
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: syracuse ny
Posts: 8
Change4penny, thank you for comment I appreciate that. yeah we tried cold turkey so many times and never made it past 10 days. In some ways we did get on the suboxone to avoid the withdrawls, but we had been fighting this demon so long that we just want to be normal again so bad. We really dont ever want to go back to this horrible addiction. I'll back up a little to give you some more info on my backround. I have been married for 10 years, I have a 13 year old son and a 6 year old daughter. When i was pregnant for my daughter someone introduced my husband to crack, of course he tried it and got addicted to it. It was one of the worst times in my life. He was not the same person anymore all our money was gone, I was pretty much raising the kids on my own. That was such a dark time for me in my life. There were many times that I almost left him because i couldn't go through it anymore, but i loved him so much that i feared if i did leave what would happen to him? I know now that he would have contiued to spiral out of control and honestly i think he would've died. Anyways he'd stay clean for a couple weeks and go back it kept happening. well the last time he got clean for a couple weeks, he had gotten hurt at work and was given hydros from the doctor. so he started taking them and he was like wow iv'e never felt so good in my life, eventually i ended up trying them as well, and that's how it all started. The only kinda good thing to happen was it got him away from crack for good, but open a whole new window of addiction not for just him but for me as well. The pill addiction quickly spiraled out of control we were spending all of our money and taking more and more to feel the same effect from them. We both were becoming increasingly depressed as the addiction was controling us. take a pill to get up in the morning, take a pill to clean, take a pill to go places, everything we did revoled around whether or not we had pills and if we didn't we just layed around like we were dying, I'm so sick of it I never want to go back. I know were taking the suboxone but this is the first time i actually feel confident that we can do this. penny congrats on 17 monthes, that is so amazing. I get a sense of peace coming to these sites, and reading other peoples stories it gives me hope that we can beat
this.
melanie
this.
melanie
Member
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: CA Native
Posts: 2,509
I like that plan you posted. I am CONSTANTLY harping on this site about doctors prescribing too much subs to people. Unfortunately, I often run afoul of the 'no medical advice' rule when I do so. I think you're being very smart by taking responsibility for your own treatment plan with that stuff, because in my experience, 95% of doctors out there don't know a damn thing about properly treating people with it.
But that's just between you and me. To everybody else: Just do what your doctor tells you!
P.S. I got clean off a 240-400mg/day OC habit using subs, weaning down and off over 7 months. I'm now at 33 months clean and sober, and life is great ... if I can do it, you and hubby can do it too!
But that's just between you and me. To everybody else: Just do what your doctor tells you!
P.S. I got clean off a 240-400mg/day OC habit using subs, weaning down and off over 7 months. I'm now at 33 months clean and sober, and life is great ... if I can do it, you and hubby can do it too!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: syracuse ny
Posts: 8
thanks bvaljalo for your post. I agree 100% i think doctors hand this stuff out too freely and at higher than needed doses, I don't know if it's intentional to keep you on it for long periods so they make more money or if the just don't know enough about suboxone. I think the lower doses are the way to go, it makes it less likely to abuse it or stang on it for too long. We are doing well and i'm very encouraged we have made it this far. congratulations on making it 33 monthes that is great. That gives me alot of hope, I really want to beat this addiction this time. I comend people that get off the opiates cold turkey because i wasn't strong enough it is a very difficult addiction to beat. The worst part for me has always been the mental withdrawls. The physical is bad but goes away in a few days. The mental part lasts so much longer. When I tried cold turkey on numerous occcasions i would have panic attacks, hot flashes severe depression to the point that i considered suicide i couldn't take it, that's not me at all. It really freaked me out. Who knew something as little as a pain pill could do so much damage. The suboxone has been a life saver for us.
thank you everyone for your feedback
Melanie
thank you everyone for your feedback
Melanie
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Midland, NC
Posts: 1,266
Melanie, I'm so glad you and your husband are on the road to recovery. I know it's hard, but it's so rewarding. I'm still tapering the Sub slowly and I'm not feeling too much discomfort in doing so. I just feel like I've worked a strong enough program and have given myself the time needed to get used to this new life, now, I feel it's time to stop the Sub. But, however, once I get down to 1mg, I think I might stay there for a little while and see how it goes. I'm not gonna feel pressured to come off the sub completely until I'm 100% ready, because, it has truly saved me, and given me the hope that I could actually be a productive person, wife, mother and daughter. Someone that my family can be proud of.
Good luck to you, your husband and family.
Penny
Good luck to you, your husband and family.
Penny
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Midland, NC
Posts: 1,266
By the way Melanie....You mentioned that your husband was addicted to crack cocaine...and I was as well. I had snorted coke on and off for years, but was always able to stop. When I was introduced to crack cocaine, It brought me to my knees and for 18 months straight, I chased that high everyday...I took the pills to feel 'normal'...I smoked cocaine to get high.
As I said, the sub has helped me tremendously, keeping me from craving opiates, but, the desire to use coke has been there, and honestly, that's where the most danger is for me in my recovery. Cocaine is such a mental addiction. When I'm struggling with thoughts of using...it's not for the pills, it's for coke.
I hope and pray that you're husband is prepared for these cravings, because he will no doubt have them...that's where a strong program in place will help the most.
These cravings for coke can be strong especially because of being vulnerable because of feeling all the feelings he will experience with coming off the pills.
Has he mentioned feeling this way?
As I said, the sub has helped me tremendously, keeping me from craving opiates, but, the desire to use coke has been there, and honestly, that's where the most danger is for me in my recovery. Cocaine is such a mental addiction. When I'm struggling with thoughts of using...it's not for the pills, it's for coke.
I hope and pray that you're husband is prepared for these cravings, because he will no doubt have them...that's where a strong program in place will help the most.
These cravings for coke can be strong especially because of being vulnerable because of feeling all the feelings he will experience with coming off the pills.
Has he mentioned feeling this way?
Member
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Middle of MO
Posts: 666
I always hate seeing the words "induction" and "taper" in the same sentence. Assuming (as you mentioned) that you guys are opiate addicts and are going onto maintenance, tapering off should be the furthest thing from your mind. Worrying about dose, time in treatment , and taper plans prior to even starting (or just starting) is an easy way to shift the focus from what is most important: getting stable, developing a recovery program and support system, and working on yourselves. Only after all of that is achieved and maintained should you even begin to think of tapering.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: syracuse ny
Posts: 8
hey penny, yeah he says the craving is still there even 5 years later. But he has told me and i believe him that he will never go back to it. I was never addicted to crack/ coccaine or did i ever use it. but my husband tells me that it was easier to get off that than the opiates. I know for me it has been very hard. Like i said, he said the urge will always be there but he will never touch it again. I hope one day it will be the same with the opiates, not that i even want to think about it but, I know it is always gonna haunt me because i enjoyed it a little too much ya know. Penny i think you are doing wonderful in your recovery, and if your ever having one of those days with the cravings just think about where you were 17 monthes ago and how you never want to be like that again. You have made huge steps in your recovery. As far as the subs I know everyones treatment plan is different and i agree that you should stay at the 1mg mark for a while. I think if it helps you to get through this nightmare you should stay on it as long as you need to, to get where you need to be.
Tsmba as far as my post about induction and taper plan i posted it because the guy that wrote has helped alot of people get clean. I just think the doctors start people out on too high of a dose. I'm just speaking from my experience, (assuming) i was really an opiate addict which i am! I took very high amounts of oxy and pretty much any other opiate for a long time. I'm not suggesting that people get on suboxone and get right off it. I just posted it because the tapering part is very important to be sucessful. I know you may not agree with my method of quitting, but we have made it 24 days now and that's longer than weve ever made it. I'm pretty happy about that. I Know that we want our life back I'm sick of my day being revolved around pills. I just want to be normal again and i know that is gonna take a long time, and i'll always be a recovering addict. My husband is my support system as I am his. we help eachother through this. i'm sorry if you don't agree with it.
P.S Thank you Penny for your comment and for your story it has been very helpful knowing your in a similar situation as us. I appreciate your comments i have read some of your other posts. I will be praying for you each day. You seem like a wonderful person.
Melanie
Tsmba as far as my post about induction and taper plan i posted it because the guy that wrote has helped alot of people get clean. I just think the doctors start people out on too high of a dose. I'm just speaking from my experience, (assuming) i was really an opiate addict which i am! I took very high amounts of oxy and pretty much any other opiate for a long time. I'm not suggesting that people get on suboxone and get right off it. I just posted it because the tapering part is very important to be sucessful. I know you may not agree with my method of quitting, but we have made it 24 days now and that's longer than weve ever made it. I'm pretty happy about that. I Know that we want our life back I'm sick of my day being revolved around pills. I just want to be normal again and i know that is gonna take a long time, and i'll always be a recovering addict. My husband is my support system as I am his. we help eachother through this. i'm sorry if you don't agree with it.
P.S Thank you Penny for your comment and for your story it has been very helpful knowing your in a similar situation as us. I appreciate your comments i have read some of your other posts. I will be praying for you each day. You seem like a wonderful person.
Melanie
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Midland, NC
Posts: 1,266
Melanie, as I've said before, my addiction to opiates was a long one...more than ten years. The sub saved me, but, the coke, well, I've had to do that on my on. The problem with coke is, no, it doesn't really have any physical withdrawls, but mentally, it's been a challenge.
I mean, the pills had such a hold on my life, I couldn't do anything without them, vacation, holidays, family reunions, etc. I had to have them to function normally, or, what I thought was normal. It was like being in prison, enslaved to that pill bottle. I'd get down to say ten pills and literally have a panic attack, frozen with fear, wondering how I was gonna get more. That's no way to live.
You and your husband are gonna be just fine...trust me when I say this...if I can do it, you two can do it.
Don't let anyone knock how you quit...as long as you quit. If I'd worried about what ppl said about me being on Suboxone, I'd have surely relapsed by now. I do agree that doctors put ppl on way to high a dose to begin with. That's why when they had me on 16mg a year ago, I felt that it was too much for me and I took myself down to 8mg on my own.
You and your husband are in my prayers. I'm pulling for you guys. It's a very tough journey, but very much worth it, I promise.
Penny
I mean, the pills had such a hold on my life, I couldn't do anything without them, vacation, holidays, family reunions, etc. I had to have them to function normally, or, what I thought was normal. It was like being in prison, enslaved to that pill bottle. I'd get down to say ten pills and literally have a panic attack, frozen with fear, wondering how I was gonna get more. That's no way to live.
You and your husband are gonna be just fine...trust me when I say this...if I can do it, you two can do it.
Don't let anyone knock how you quit...as long as you quit. If I'd worried about what ppl said about me being on Suboxone, I'd have surely relapsed by now. I do agree that doctors put ppl on way to high a dose to begin with. That's why when they had me on 16mg a year ago, I felt that it was too much for me and I took myself down to 8mg on my own.
You and your husband are in my prayers. I'm pulling for you guys. It's a very tough journey, but very much worth it, I promise.
Penny
Now with fewer opiates!
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,405
I have worked with many suboxone users. The greatest failure rate I have seen is among users who take it on themselves to monitor and adjust their dosages.
You're not willing to follow a taper offered by a doctor, but you are willing to follow some anonymous poster on an Internet forum?
I appeared to have missed- where are you getting suboxone if not from a doctor who is monitoring your taper?
If it is a doctor, does he/she know your plan?
I do apologize if I missed this info.
You're not willing to follow a taper offered by a doctor, but you are willing to follow some anonymous poster on an Internet forum?
I appeared to have missed- where are you getting suboxone if not from a doctor who is monitoring your taper?
If it is a doctor, does he/she know your plan?
I do apologize if I missed this info.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: syracuse ny
Posts: 8
ok, well aparently it's hard to come on these sites for support, because so many people just question you, or say your doing wrong or you'll relapse. Just because my my doctor prescribed a higher amount and i chose a lower amount i'm gonna fail? That was my husbands and i chose to do so. I am not abusing them as a matter of fact were doing quite well. In my opinion if we can take less than prescribed and not be sick then why the hell not? Look alot of these doctors barely know anything about suboxone, we dont have health insurance. I had to pay 300 just for the doctors visit. Why should i take more than i need? I'm trying to get away from that self medicating lifestyle. as far as taking advice from some anyomous person on the internet. I was in contact with him for monthes about the suboxone, a website very similar to this one, before i ever even started. I'm sorry if you don't agree with my method of getting clean. I think everyone on this sight has the same goal to stay sober and start a new life. I have only wrote 2 other people here that were very supportive and i thank them for that. Ultimatley that's all i wanted was support,somewhere i could go talk if i was having a bad day, meet people in similar situations, and hear there stories. maybe i shouldn't post at all here anymore.
Melanie
Melanie
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: syracuse ny
Posts: 8
Penny, I just wanted to reply to your post. I know exactly what you are talking about it is so similar to my situation. I was inprisoned by opiates, they ran my life for so long that sometimes i still don't know what it's like to be normal again, it seems to get easier as the days go by. I do know were doing the right thing, and i pray we get through it this time. I think mental addiction is alot worse than physical addiction, it's takes over your brain. I can only hope that one day it will just be a distant memory a bad memory. I never want to go back to those days of chasing pills and spending all our money on it. I really hate myself for alot of things that i have done because of this addiction. You are doing great penny, hopefully in time you wont even think about it. I believe we have to be stronger than our addiction. take care. I will keep you in my prayers everyday.
Melanie
Melanie
Now with fewer opiates!
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Southern New Jersey, USA
Posts: 1,405
So sorry-
What I meant to say was this-
I have never seen anyone have anything but total success with suboxone, especially when they ignore their doctor's advice and self-prescribe.
I forgot this site is for total support, even if you recognize someone may be doing something that could cause them harm.
I am especially glad that the several people on SR that take suboxone have chimed in to help you understand that it's most wise to follow advice from online strangers and to make sure to be dishonest with the prescribing doctor. That's almost a guarantee of success, recovery and a happy life.
That's what you apparently wanted to hear, so that's what I should have said.
Really, really sorry to have given a darn about your health, safety and recovery.
Big hug!
What I meant to say was this-
I have never seen anyone have anything but total success with suboxone, especially when they ignore their doctor's advice and self-prescribe.
I forgot this site is for total support, even if you recognize someone may be doing something that could cause them harm.
I am especially glad that the several people on SR that take suboxone have chimed in to help you understand that it's most wise to follow advice from online strangers and to make sure to be dishonest with the prescribing doctor. That's almost a guarantee of success, recovery and a happy life.
That's what you apparently wanted to hear, so that's what I should have said.
Really, really sorry to have given a darn about your health, safety and recovery.
Big hug!
The truth shall set you free
Join Date: Apr 2004
Location: United States
Posts: 5,267
When the day comes when you are no longer using subs, do you have the tools to fight off cravings or an obsession set off by a trigger? I tried staying clean on will power; I cave in when the obsessions become stronger then my will power. I had to lean the hard way. Drugs were never my problem, I was the problem.
On this link there is a boatload of recovery resources. Pick one, use it, save your butt from future misery.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...i-recover.html
Ivan
On this link there is a boatload of recovery resources. Pick one, use it, save your butt from future misery.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...i-recover.html
Ivan
Friend
Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: East Coast, Killa
Posts: 372
Hi Melanie, welcome to SR 
I am on a subutex taper at the moment as well. I was started at 16 mgs and stabilized at 8 mgs. I was on the subutex for about 2 yrs and have been working on my recovery, and have recently started tapering down. TBH, I'm not sure whether I'm entirely ready to come off altogether, but it was a 'family decision' as it has become very expensive. I am still working hard on my recovery and I know I will have to do this for the rest of my life. I was pretty lucky when I started to have a dr who knew his stuff. I felt that 16 mgs was too high of a dosage as well -- he worked with me and got me down to the 8 mgs. (eventually, see story at the bottom 
)
Have you discussed your concerns with your dr about being on too high a dose? I agree that not all drs know all there is to know about Suboxone/Subutex and ORT, but usually they are open to researching and learning more. Maybe you should let your dr know that you feel you'd be okay on a lower dose? Did you show him the taper plan you posted here?? You never know, he could be completely open to it! I think it's good to follow what your dr tells you closely - 1) b/c they're drs and 2) to hold yourself accountable. It sounds like you are on a good path to recovery and an open and honest relationship with your doctor is just another step in that healthy recovery. I know I self-medicated throughout my active addiction. When I started my recovery from opiates, I decided to hand that over to my dr. I'm not saying don't be responsible for yourself - but have an open and honest discussion about it with him - he might be more receptive than you think!
BTW - when I was first started on 16 mgs and went down to 8 mgs I did not tell my dr. I thought that if I cut the dosage in half and saved half the RX, I could save myself $$ in the end by having the left over pills when I was ready to taper off. After about a month of this, I realized every time I went to my dr and we discussed dosage and how I was doing, I was lying to him. Sure, I was taking less than he thought I was, but I was still lying. Made me feel like I was still in active addiction and my dr was my dope dealer. So I got honest with him. Just my experience!
I am on a subutex taper at the moment as well. I was started at 16 mgs and stabilized at 8 mgs. I was on the subutex for about 2 yrs and have been working on my recovery, and have recently started tapering down. TBH, I'm not sure whether I'm entirely ready to come off altogether, but it was a 'family decision' as it has become very expensive. I am still working hard on my recovery and I know I will have to do this for the rest of my life. I was pretty lucky when I started to have a dr who knew his stuff. I felt that 16 mgs was too high of a dosage as well -- he worked with me and got me down to the 8 mgs. (eventually, see story at the bottom )Have you discussed your concerns with your dr about being on too high a dose? I agree that not all drs know all there is to know about Suboxone/Subutex and ORT, but usually they are open to researching and learning more. Maybe you should let your dr know that you feel you'd be okay on a lower dose? Did you show him the taper plan you posted here?? You never know, he could be completely open to it! I think it's good to follow what your dr tells you closely - 1) b/c they're drs
and 2) to hold yourself accountable. It sounds like you are on a good path to recovery and an open and honest relationship with your doctor is just another step in that healthy recovery. I know I self-medicated throughout my active addiction. When I started my recovery from opiates, I decided to hand that over to my dr. I'm not saying don't be responsible for yourself - but have an open and honest discussion about it with him - he might be more receptive than you think!BTW - when I was first started on 16 mgs and went down to 8 mgs I did not tell my dr. I thought that if I cut the dosage in half and saved half the RX, I could save myself $$ in the end by having the left over pills when I was ready to taper off. After about a month of this, I realized every time I went to my dr and we discussed dosage and how I was doing, I was lying to him. Sure, I was taking less than he thought I was, but I was still lying. Made me feel like I was still in active addiction and my dr was my dope dealer. So I got honest with him. Just my experience!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Midland, NC
Posts: 1,266
Melanie, just wanted to stop by and see how your day is going...The weather here in NC is beautiful and it's truly helped me out of the rut I was in over the weekend....been out doing some yard work.
Hope all is well with you and your husband both,
You remain in my prayers,
Penny
Hope all is well with you and your husband both,
You remain in my prayers,
Penny
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
